Meister Eckhart vs. Columba

Our trek into saintly Quirks and Quotes continues with Meister Eckhart taking on Columba. To make it to the Saintly Sixteen Eckhart somehow managed to defeat Drogo, the patron saint of coffee, while Columba snuck past Kateri Tekakwitha in the closest encounter (of the saintly kind) of Lent Madness 2016.

Don’t forget, especially if you’re just getting started in Lent Madness, that links to all the previous battles are available on the Bracket page (scroll down). In other words, what you read in this round isn’t all that has been written about our saints. You can read the initial bios in additional to these write-ups and make a fully informed decision. To make this as user friendly as possible, you can even click the links in the first paragraph above to revisit the first round matchups of both Meister Eckhart and Columba. Yes, throughout Lent, the Supreme Executive Committee continues to lose sleep on your behalf.

Yesterday, Albert Schweitzer made it past Methodius 56% to 44% to claim his spot in the Elate Eight. He’ll face the winner of Roch vs. Julian of Norwich.

And in case you missed yesterday’s edition of Monday Madness, you can watch it here. Learn how to submit your Mug Shot (and view several examples) to have a crack at winning St. Francis of Assisi!

Meister Eckhart

meister-eckhart“The eye, with which I see God, is the same eye with which God sees me; my eye and God’s eye are only one eye and one seeing and one knowing and one love.”

So taught Meister Eckhart, Dominican friar, professor, preacher, teacher, and mystic.

Eckhart received his formal schooling from the University of Paris, the greatest institution of higher education in late 13th century Europe. However, Eckhart’s work of preaching and providing spiritual counsel to the Dominican nuns of Saxony was not a one-way street; his informal education came from the women whom he conversed with on spiritual matters, and his writings show a familiarity with the mystical mothers of the Rhineland including Hadewijch and Mechtild of Magdeburg.

In summing up his own preaching, Eckhart said that everything he taught was a variation on four intertwined themes:

“When I preach, I am careful to speak about detachment and that a person should become free of self and of all things. Secondly, that one should be reformed in the simple good that is God. Thirdly, that one should think of the great nobility which God has placed in the soul, so that a person can thereby come to God in a wonderful way. Fourthly, concerning the purity of divine nature—there is such brilliance in it that it is inexpressible!”

Basically, Eckhart is saying that through humility, love, and discernment, believers are able to break through their own distracting notions and ideas about both God and the self (that’s what he means by being “free of self and all things”) to discover that God and the soul are—by nature—at one.

As one aspect of this teaching, Eckhart insists that creation and incarnation should be understood as two sides of the same coin, and uses the image of a dance of sorts: “The Father speaks the Son always, in unity, and pours out in him all created things. They are all called to return into whence they have flowed out. All their life and being is a calling and a hastening back to God from whom they have issued.”

While his Dominican superiors approved of his teaching, the Archbishop of Cologne and later the pope condemned Eckhart’s writings after his death based on excerpts taken out of context. The charges focused around technical statements suggesting some aspects of the soul were uncreated, that Eckhart failed to draw a sharp enough distinction between Creator and creature. His defenders argue that the context of his works provide assurances of his orthodoxy, and Eckhart himself declared that he had no intention of teaching anything contrary to the faith.

With that, Eckhart himself receives the last word: “He who lives in the goodness of his nature lives in God’s love; and love has no why.”

— Derek Olsen


Columba was the founder of the abbey at Iona–the center of Celtic Christian activity through the Middle Ages and beyond. According to several sources, Columba was initially baptized Crimthan, which means “The Fox.” However, as he grew up, his patient and loving demeanor didn’t fit his name, so he was renamed Columba, which means “The Dove.” Despite his name change, Columba cut an arresting figure: “He was a striking figure of great stature and powerful build, with a loud, melodious voice which could be heard from one hilltop to another.”

The two battles that he was involved in really did pain him. It was Columba himself who suggested his exile to Scotland to the council of monks–vowing that he would go forth and convert all the world in order to make penance for those he had hurt, and never again see Ireland. He chose Iona as a settling place because it had no view of the Irish coast, as opposed to the first island where he landed.

From Iona, he traveled all over Scotland, and his missionary efforts included people and monsters. Apparently, in August of 565, Columba was wandering around the Highlands and came up to the River Ness. He noticed some Pict men dragging the body of a man out of the lake. The man had fallen out of his boat and been chomped by Nessie. The people on the shore had cast out fishing lines to bring back the body. Columba, unperturbed, asked someone to swim across the lake and retrieve the boat so he could cross the river. Lugne Moncumin (one of the men) quickly stripped and dove in the water.

As he was swimming across, he woke up Nessie again, and she charged at him, ready to chow down a second time. Columba raised his arm and rebuked the sea monster in the name of the crucified Christ, while making the sign of the cross. He said, “You will come no further. Go back! Do not touch this man!” At once, the monster receded. “Quicker than if pulled down by ropes” writes Columba’s biographer. The Picts were amazed and impressed.

Lugne retrieved the boat unharmed. And everyone, including Nessie, became Christian. Apparently, this story in Columba’s biography has been used extensively by crypto-zoologists in the search for the Loch Ness monster.)

He did return to Ireland once, in 575 CE, in order to settle a dispute between the king and the league of poets. In order to hold to the terms of his exile, he traveled blindfolded the entire time. The poets had sent for him because of his well-known love of books; however, he was so reasonable and calm, he succeeded in getting the king to compromise and see the dispute in the poets’ way.

Columba’s dedication to evangelism and the wonders of the written word have left a lasting impact on the world

— Megan Castellan

Meister Eckhart vs. Columba

  • Columba (60%, 3,755 Votes)
  • Meister Eckhart (40%, 2,458 Votes)

Total Voters: 6,213

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166 Comments to "Meister Eckhart vs. Columba"

  1. March 8, 2016 - 8:05 am | Permalink

    Wow, at a great total of three votes, Columba is way out ahead!

    • Christina Thom's Gravatar Christina Thom
      March 8, 2016 - 10:14 am | Permalink

      I am Irish who else could I vote for.

    • Rhonda's Gravatar Rhonda
      March 8, 2016 - 11:20 am | Permalink

      To The SEC;
      I was on the train last night explaining LentMadness to my Catholic friend (rocking Episcopal, here)
      And the person behind us tapped me on the shoulder. And then another person asked a question, and I just kept telling them how awesome lent madness is and how much fun.
      By the time we got to our stop there were 8 people on their phones headed to the site.
      Hey,mid Colmba can convert Nessie, surly I get something for preaching on a train.
      Can I be a Saint now? Can I? Huh? Please?

      You guys are THE BEST!!!

      • March 8, 2016 - 11:25 am | Permalink

        Lent Madness evangelism at its best! Your reward will be in heaven.

      • Shelly's Gravatar Shelly
        March 8, 2016 - 1:12 pm | Permalink

        I’m not good at regular evangelism at all, but I tell everyone I know how much fun Lent Madness is!

        • Glenis Elliott's Gravatar Glenis Elliott
          March 8, 2016 - 1:23 pm | Permalink

          That is exactly how I feel.

      • Jennifer Franz's Gravatar Jennifer Franz
        March 8, 2016 - 2:47 pm | Permalink

        Absolutely marvelous story!

      • Deacon Carol's Gravatar Deacon Carol
        March 8, 2016 - 2:47 pm | Permalink

        I have enjoyed this Lenten discipline more each day. Columbo is my choice, a doer rather than a mystic.

  2. Oliver eight years old's Gravatar Oliver eight years old
    March 8, 2016 - 8:06 am | Permalink

    I voted for saint Columba because my birthday is in June and that is his month.

    • Mary's Gravatar Mary
      March 8, 2016 - 8:33 am | Permalink

      I was born in June too so Columba is my choice.

    • Beth's Gravatar Beth
      March 8, 2016 - 10:06 am | Permalink

      when in doubt, I vote with Oliver

    • March 8, 2016 - 11:01 am | Permalink

      Oliver, That is a good reason to vote for Columba! 🙂

    • Joyce Rush's Gravatar Joyce Rush
      March 9, 2016 - 12:12 am | Permalink

      Me, too, Oliver!

  3. Ann in MI's Gravatar Ann in MI
    March 8, 2016 - 8:12 am | Permalink

    I love Nessie — so Columba gets my vote!

    • Laura B's Gravatar Laura B
      March 8, 2016 - 9:00 am | Permalink

      Yes! Hail the saint who converted Nessie!

    • Oliver_ eight year old's Gravatar Oliver_ eight year old
      March 8, 2016 - 7:49 pm | Permalink

      There is a mistake on the bracket on February 22. Columba has 51% and Kateri Tekakwitha has 51%. That means they tied. But Columba won that day.

      • Alicia's Gravatar Alicia
        March 9, 2016 - 6:47 am | Permalink

        Good catch, Oliver! Your math teachers must be proud! It looks like only the “headline” on the first page is wrong. When you click on the link, Columba had 51% and Kateri had 49%. It looks like only 130 votes were the difference in Columba winning. I am now wondering what the narrowest margin was in Lent Madness!

  4. St. Celia's Gravatar St. Celia
    March 8, 2016 - 8:14 am | Permalink

    Mystics now and mystics forever. Meister Eckhart is the real deal here. Forget the Loch Ness monster. God made Leviathan for sport. Eckhart is one of the great figures of Christian history. What impresses me most in his write-up today is that he was a familiar of some of the women mystics of his time: Mechtild and Hadewijch. He learned much from women. Eckhart was not the first and will not be the last great thinker in Christian history to run afoul of the authorities. What would the church do without her brilliant and passionate children who push her forward into new life in the light? It’s Eckhart for me today.

    • SusanLee's Gravatar SusanLee
      March 8, 2016 - 9:34 am | Permalink

      (Nice photo! You did it!)

    • Harlie Youngblood's Gravatar Harlie Youngblood
      March 8, 2016 - 9:57 am | Permalink

      “God made Leviathan for sport”.
      Good reference!

    • Rhonda's Gravatar Rhonda
      March 8, 2016 - 10:30 am | Permalink

      I couldn’t have sad it better, St. Celia.
      I voted for Eckhart❤️
      ‘… Love has no why’

      • Janet Birckhead's Gravatar Janet Birckhead
        March 8, 2016 - 3:34 pm | Permalink

        Rhonda, I was leaning towards Meister Eckhart but your quote “Love has no why” sealed the deal.

        I had heard of Meister Eckhart but have not read any of his work — which I now want to do.

    • Lea's Gravatar Lea
      March 8, 2016 - 10:53 am | Permalink

      I’m with St. Celia!

    • Joanna Burt's Gravatar Joanna Burt
      March 8, 2016 - 11:10 am | Permalink

      I voted for Meister Eckhart, too, as St. Celia did. My reasoning is similar; if he was wise enough to consult and exchange thoughts with women, I have to vote for that!

    • Marilyn's Gravatar Marilyn
      March 8, 2016 - 4:38 pm | Permalink

      St. Celia, you state the case I would make exactly! I voted for Meister Eckhart too for the same reasons as you did.

  5. Kim's Gravatar Kim
    March 8, 2016 - 8:17 am | Permalink

    Iona – place that has spoken most deeply to me, ever – Columba it is.

    • March 8, 2016 - 10:03 am | Permalink

      I am with you, Kim. I can conjure Iona in my moments of need and I am there again, feeling the wind and sensing the spirit of all who have prayed there. It is truly a thin place that claims you.

      I do, however, love Eckhart’s understanding of prayer.

    • Janet Congdon's Gravatar Janet Congdon
      March 8, 2016 - 8:54 pm | Permalink

      I’ve been on Iona several times also, plan to go again this August, it is the most spiritual place I’ve ever experienced. Hurrah for Columba!

  6. March 8, 2016 - 8:18 am | Permalink

    Team Columba!

    • Eileen Novotny's Gravatar Eileen Novotny
      March 8, 2016 - 10:47 am | Permalink

      This is a hard choice for me. Columba whose footsteps I followed on pilgrimage in Ireland –his exile to Iona was out of a spirit of sorrow and penance. Our diocesan cathedral is St. Columba. But I also support all those who fell afoul of the hierarchy and were treated unjustly.

  7. Michael's Gravatar Michael
    March 8, 2016 - 8:21 am | Permalink

    The power of myth and legend combined with the indisputable power of the Gospel powered my vote for a giant of a Saint….Columba. I mean who else could stop Nessie other than a Saint.

  8. Gloria Ishida's Gravatar Gloria Ishida
    March 8, 2016 - 8:21 am | Permalink

    Today is International Women’s Day. Meister Eckhart listened to learned from women.
    He gets my vote.

    • Bring Back Philander's Gravatar Bring Back Philander
      March 8, 2016 - 9:48 am | Permalink

      I admit, my vote is being swayed by having Eckhart’s appeal land on International Women’s Day. I blame the SEC; obviously they planned this. (joke! joke!)

      Going to have to give this one some thought and reflection.

  9. Richard in TX's Gravatar Richard in TX
    March 8, 2016 - 8:23 am | Permalink

    Columba is the man. The whole of Iona is for me a “thin” place, and it is so because of the devotions of those who lived and worshiped there, men and women.

  10. Elizabeth Massey's Gravatar Elizabeth Massey
    March 8, 2016 - 8:24 am | Permalink

    I voted for each of these saints in the round of 32. Now I want to vote for each of them again! Choices, choices. I finally came down for Columba – for his own conversion of spirit, his vigor, his leadership, his example, his founding of Iona – such a vivid active spiritual center today – and for his charisma over Nessie. His vitality lives on!

  11. Tready3's Gravatar Tready3
    March 8, 2016 - 8:25 am | Permalink

    Columba may ride Nessie to victory, but my vote and nature Echo Eckart

  12. Debbie Northern's Gravatar Debbie Northern
    March 8, 2016 - 8:25 am | Permalink

    Still can’t see the appeal of Columba who had to go to an island all by himself so he wouldn’t start another war! I want to declare an injustice to Kateri and ask that she be brought back for next year’s bracket!! Meister Eckhart for me!

    • Kathy in Nicaragua's Gravatar Kathy in Nicaragua
      March 8, 2016 - 9:18 am | Permalink

      Megan Castellan’s write-up on Columba was so moving that although I had fully intended to vote for Meister Eckhart I had to stop and think for a good long while. It was finally because I had wanted Kateri to have won in the first round that I went ahead and voted for Meister Eckhart.

    • March 8, 2016 - 10:04 am | Permalink

      If you ever travel to Iona, you will understand. I do hope you get the opportunity.
      It is a stunningly beautiful, mystical place.

    • Harlie Youngblood's Gravatar Harlie Youngblood
      March 8, 2016 - 11:09 am | Permalink

      Columba didn’t leave Ireland so he “wouldn’t start another war”. He left as penance for the wars he had been involved in. If we’re going to hold sins against him which he has repented of, then we should hold it against Paul for persecuting the Church before he became a Christian.

      • Conny Santana's Gravatar Conny Santana
        March 8, 2016 - 12:46 pm | Permalink

        Interesting. I like your thought on this. Interesting perspective.

        • Harlie Youngblood's Gravatar Harlie Youngblood
          March 8, 2016 - 8:21 pm | Permalink

          Thanks, Conny.

          • andrea's Gravatar andrea
            March 9, 2016 - 12:28 am | Permalink

            I agree with Conny.

    • Fiona's Gravatar Fiona
      March 8, 2016 - 11:18 am | Permalink

      Columba travelled to Iona with twelve companions so not alone, and there are other versions of the story of Columba’s voluntary exile that him in a much less violent light.

  13. Donna Devlin's Gravatar Donna Devlin
    March 8, 2016 - 8:32 am | Permalink

    Columba —for his month and Oliver’s and my birthday and dear Nessie and all things Irish. Go GREEN!

  14. Michelle C's Gravatar Michelle C
    March 8, 2016 - 8:33 am | Permalink

    Columba for me today. To return to the homeland you love and go blindfolded so that you don’t violate your vow to never set eyes on it again. Wow! Also, I just can’t resist someone who tamed Nessie. 🙂

  15. Karen C.'s Gravatar Karen C.
    March 8, 2016 - 8:36 am | Permalink

    I’ve been reading about Meister Eckhart since his last time in the ‘dome.’ Truly profound. A couple good zingers:
    “God is at home. It’s we who have gone out for a walk.” and
    “Truly, it is in darkness that one finds the light; so when we are in sorrow, it is then this light is nearest of all to us.”
    He gets my vote.

    • JustMeJo's Gravatar JustMeJo
      March 8, 2016 - 8:52 am | Permalink

      Ahhhhh! Thank you, Karen C.! I was struggling mightily with this decision, but that first quote sealed the deal for me! It is, indeed, we who “go out for a walk”! Meister Eckhart it shall be!

    • Anne Lyon's Gravatar Anne Lyon
      March 8, 2016 - 10:30 am | Permalink

      I wish i had seen this before i voted!!! After reading the above quotes, I did a little more digging…another one of my favorites-“If the only prayer you ever say in your entire life is thank you, it will be enough.” (too bad i can’t change my vote…doesn’t look like Meister Eckhart will be moving on.)

    • Shelly's Gravatar Shelly
      March 8, 2016 - 1:22 pm | Permalink

      You may just have helped me decide as well.

    • Gay Jolley's Gravatar Gay Jolley
      March 8, 2016 - 1:48 pm | Permalink


  16. Patricia Aldridge's Gravatar Patricia Aldridge
    March 8, 2016 - 8:37 am | Permalink

    I have loved St. Columba for a long time. He built his monastery on the island my family came from (part of it) and years ago, while reading about him, I discovered that we share a birthday. Patsy McGuire Aldridge

  17. Liz Parmalee's Gravatar Liz Parmalee
    March 8, 2016 - 8:38 am | Permalink

    A man who learns from women! He has my vote! Meistersinger Eckhart

  18. Liz Parmalee's Gravatar Liz Parmalee
    March 8, 2016 - 8:39 am | Permalink

    Meister Eckhart! Auto correct is awful

    • SusanLee's Gravatar SusanLee
      March 8, 2016 - 9:41 am | Permalink

      I don’t know–Meistersinger sounds festive! Reminds me of the villain in the old Christmas special, “Santa Claus Is Coming To Town” — Burgermeister Meisterburger!

  19. March 8, 2016 - 8:40 am | Permalink

    I’m not really sold on mysticism; it mystifies me. So Saint Columba it is.

  20. Dutton Morehouse's Gravatar Dutton Morehouse
    March 8, 2016 - 8:41 am | Permalink

    Columba, fierce but humble. His life bore the fruit of Iona, fount of spirituality.

  21. March 8, 2016 - 8:42 am | Permalink

    We have a Saint Columba’s church in our diocese, but not a Saint Meister Eckhart’s, so Columba gets my vote.

  22. Kim Morse's Gravatar Kim Morse
    March 8, 2016 - 8:49 am | Permalink

    “…And love has no why.” Eckhart it has to be.

  23. Susan Elliott's Gravatar Susan Elliott
    March 8, 2016 - 8:49 am | Permalink

    “Columba’s dedication to evangelism and the wonders of the written word have left a lasting impact on the world” — and on St. Columba’s Episcopal Church in Washington, D.C., where the Loch Ness monster story is frequently enacted on St. Columba Day, the Sunday closest to June 9. Yep, it’s a wild story, but in the end it’s about faith and the power of God. Go Columba!

  24. Dwight's Gravatar Dwight
    March 8, 2016 - 8:50 am | Permalink

    Eckhart was an amazing communicator of the best of church beliefs. He was far ahead of his time in supporting women’s causes. He deserves our admiration more than a legend.

    • Barbara MacR's Gravatar Barbara MacR
      March 8, 2016 - 11:28 am | Permalink

      The Nessie story is a legend. The rest of Columba’s achievements aren’t.

  25. Donna's Gravatar Donna
    March 8, 2016 - 8:52 am | Permalink

    For the interconnectedness of Creator and created– my vote goes to Meister Eckhardt.

  26. Dorothy Drennen's Gravatar Dorothy Drennen
    March 8, 2016 - 9:03 am | Permalink

    Meister Ekhardt for the halo. A mystic with vision far ahead of his time.

  27. Barbara S.'s Gravatar Barbara S.
    March 8, 2016 - 9:03 am | Permalink

    Wonderful write-up for Meister Eckhart, who would have gotten my vote anyway.

    • Susan Wall's Gravatar Susan Wall
      March 8, 2016 - 9:48 am | Permalink

      Yes, one of the best write-ups I’ve seen from Lent Madness.

      • Barbara S.'s Gravatar Barbara S.
        March 8, 2016 - 10:26 am | Permalink

        I think so, too.

  28. March 8, 2016 - 9:04 am | Permalink

    Columba! Got to be. Monsters and Poets…sounds like a song by the Clash.

  29. Joyce in Georgia's Gravatar Joyce in Georgia
    March 8, 2016 - 9:09 am | Permalink

    “He who lives in the goodness of his nature lives in God’s love; and love has no why.” I cannot stop thinking of that statement – “Love has no why.” I am drawn to Meister Eckhardt. His informal education came from talking with women, Dominican nuns. From them, he grew to understand the source and mystery of God’s love. “Mister Meister,” you get my vote.

  30. Greg Francis Eischeid's Gravatar Greg Francis Eischeid
    March 8, 2016 - 9:11 am | Permalink

    A vote for Meister Eckhart on International Women’s Day, he (and I) learn a lot from women, otherwise “love has no why” gets my attention

  31. March 8, 2016 - 9:13 am | Permalink

    This is a really difficult one for me today. I really love and admire each of these giants in the spiritual life. But, I have got to go with one of my patrons, Columba!

  32. Scott Elliott's Gravatar Scott Elliott
    March 8, 2016 - 9:14 am | Permalink

    Meister Eckhart for me. I feel an affinity for heretics who turn out to be completely orthodox after all.

  33. Jennifer S.'s Gravatar Jennifer S.
    March 8, 2016 - 9:17 am | Permalink

    I vote for Columba because one of my classmates used to live at Iona with her husband.

  34. March 8, 2016 - 9:19 am | Permalink

    Love has no why is wonderful. But Columba gets my vote. He settled a problem by being reasonable and calm! Fancy that! A strange concept currently. Also, I’m Irish.

  35. Eileen C. Fisher's Gravatar Eileen C. Fisher
    March 8, 2016 - 9:26 am | Permalink

    Ay Columba! ‘Nuff about Nessie. This is serious LM going on here. Meister Eckhardt really won me over with his communication with women mystics and support of women, as well as with the vital words of freedom from self and all things. Words that really spoke to me. Even if he loses, he’s made an impact on my life. Thank you, SEC and Celebrity Blogger, for opening my eyes to the life of this exemplary man.

  36. Susan C.'s Gravatar Susan C.
    March 8, 2016 - 9:28 am | Permalink

    It’s Meister Eckhart for me, for his mysticism and appreciation of the intellect and value of women.

    • pris's Gravatar pris
      March 8, 2016 - 9:35 am | Permalink


  37. Bob Duvall's Gravatar Bob Duvall
    March 8, 2016 - 9:42 am | Permalink

    Mr. E had me with one seeing, one knowing, and one love. This so reminded me of our dept. pledge taken from Wendell Berry—One Lord, one baptism, and one cornbread. Then Columba told the best fish story of the Nessie. Now that was “halt and release” fishing. He also went to battle for the Poets, and I am an English Major and a minor league poet. Columba gets my vote.

  38. Danielle's Gravatar Danielle
    March 8, 2016 - 9:42 am | Permalink

    Although I have not yet read the works of Meister Eckhart, I find in him an echo of many of my beliefs about the nature of God and the relationship to Creation, including humanity. I have to vote for him. My heart leaped as I read the summary.

  39. Sonia's Gravatar Sonia
    March 8, 2016 - 9:46 am | Permalink

    I love the legends about the Loch Ness monster but I’m not inspired up by Colomba’s encounter with Nessie. And in addition I have a granddaughter who attends a college run by Dominicans: Go, Providence! So Meister Eckart it is!

  40. SusanLee's Gravatar SusanLee
    March 8, 2016 - 9:46 am | Permalink

    Ah, I was leaning toward Eckhart already, and then the dance imagery totally won this dancer’s heart!

  41. Elaine Culver's Gravatar Elaine Culver
    March 8, 2016 - 9:46 am | Permalink

    “…love has no why.” Meister Eckhardt it is.

  42. Davis Dassori's Gravatar Davis Dassori
    March 8, 2016 - 9:50 am | Permalink

    The sheer purity of Eckhart’s thought and soul win me over. Columba has a great story, but Eckhart has no need of one.

    That said, I hope someone makes “Columba — the Movie” soon.

    • St. Celia's Gravatar St. Celia
      March 8, 2016 - 10:04 am | Permalink

      “Eckhart has no need of one.” Like!

    • Amy Jane's Gravatar Amy Jane
      March 8, 2016 - 10:09 am | Permalink

      While reading the monster story Gandalf came to mind, “Thou shalt not pass! Might Tolkein of based Gandalf on this story, and perhaps other aspects (ability yet reluctance to fight, traveling through the countryside to share beliefs and provide protection)of St. Columba’s life? If so, he has a movie or 3 to his credit.

  43. Chris Carter's Gravatar Chris Carter
    March 8, 2016 - 9:57 am | Permalink

    Once again my vote is cast based upon the vote of my students in Chapel–today the Middle School. I think it was the Lock Ness monster that garnered near universal support, although sympathy for one persecuted by the Inquisition gained Meister Ekhart a few votes.

  44. Carol Buckalew's Gravatar Carol Buckalew
    March 8, 2016 - 10:00 am | Permalink

    I have been flirting with mysticism. And I love the quote GOD is at home. It is we who have gone on a walk.
    So I’m voting for Meister Eckhart. (I must remember to not take this vote so seriously!)

  45. John Lewis's Gravatar John Lewis
    March 8, 2016 - 10:01 am | Permalink

    I think it was the additional information on Columba that interrupted my tendency to side with the Rhenish mystics. The poets are for me one of the surest paths to God. The conversion of Nessie doesn’t hurt either. A Franciscan before his time, that Columba!

  46. SusanB's Gravatar SusanB
    March 8, 2016 - 10:02 am | Permalink

    My first time reading all the comments. My vote is for Meister Eckhart. A man who learned from women! That’s awesome. ” Free of self in all things.” I am trying to learn humility. Ha, even that sounds prideful… So, I am working on it. He has something to teach me.

  47. Patrica's Gravatar Patrica
    March 8, 2016 - 10:03 am | Permalink

    Today I am voting for Meister Eckart, praising the Creator and in thanksgiving for ALL of creation. For those voting for Columba because of the legendary conversion of Nessie, maybe you are missing part of the point. EVERYONE became Christians.
    “…love (and God’s grace) has no why” but “there is such brilliance in it that it is inexpressible!”
    for which I am surely thankful. Thank you Meister Eckart for reminding me and (re-) opening my eyes!

    • Donna Devlin's Gravatar Donna Devlin
      March 8, 2016 - 10:12 am | Permalink

      I’m not missing the point, I’m looking at a different pointthan you are.

  48. Anne E.B.'s Gravatar Anne E.B.
    March 8, 2016 - 10:04 am | Permalink

    St. Columba. His gentle demeanor while championing Nessie wins me over. Go Dove!

  49. TJ's Gravatar TJ
    March 8, 2016 - 10:07 am | Permalink

    Columba! Bookish nerd, life long learner/transformer, keeper of his word, and possessor of a streak of bad-a** that (while occasionally problematic) includes the conversion of the Loch Ness Monster.

  50. aleathia (dolores) nicholson's Gravatar aleathia (dolores) nicholson
    March 8, 2016 - 10:08 am | Permalink

    Ah! I know what it is to commit errors ( really sins?) and know, without being required to do so, that penance must be paid. Columba was faithful in making amends for his failings. About converting the Loch Ness monster I don’t know but it sure adds some spice to this entry…I liken it to the monsters in our lifetime…..say, the political upheavals we now face? We need a Columba to work a healing miracle!.
    Blog on !

  51. Elizabeth's Gravatar Elizabeth
    March 8, 2016 - 10:08 am | Permalink

    I have an Irish passport, I’ve visited Iona, and Columba’s great heart has always been an inspiration to me. His work on Iona planted the seeds of Christianity throughout Scotland and parts of the British Isles, with long lasting results. Though Meister Eckhart’s life is truly commendable, it’s got to be Columba.

  52. March 8, 2016 - 10:13 am | Permalink

    That bit about Meister Eckhart learning from women would sway me on any day, so today being International Women’s Day, well, Columba had no chance. (There’s not much I like about Columba’s story to begin with, Columba was a bit of a warmonger. And the Nessie conversion is fanciful at best.)

    • Harlie Youngblood's Gravatar Harlie Youngblood
      March 8, 2016 - 11:26 am | Permalink

      People continue to write “I don’t like Columba because he was warlike”.
      But he repented of that. Why is that part of the story forgotten?

  53. Cricket Park's Gravatar Cricket Park
    March 8, 2016 - 10:15 am | Permalink

    I went round and round thinking about Eckhart, but the latent Celt in my just had to go for Columba.

  54. March 8, 2016 - 10:20 am | Permalink

    The founder of Iona has my vote today. Anyone who could impress the Picts had to be very special. Meister Eckhart was a great teacher but he was preaching “to the choir”. Whereas, Columba was blazing new trails into a part of the British Isles that even the Romans were not going invade.

  55. Barbara's Gravatar Barbara
    March 8, 2016 - 10:33 am | Permalink

    Columba may have left Ireland for cause and returned only blindfolded, but his native land held him dear: upon his death, his body was interred alongside Brigid and Patrick. Three saints all interred at Downpatrick–or so the Irish tell us.

    • Donna Devlin's Gravatar Donna Devlin
      March 8, 2016 - 3:31 pm | Permalink

      Sure’n now, would the Irish lie?

  56. Carie's Gravatar Carie
    March 8, 2016 - 10:33 am | Permalink

    Columba’s story is far fetched for me; I appreciate Meister Eckhart’s writing’ he got my vote & I do not think he was preaching to the choir especially in today’s world. Learning about these saints is the best part of Lent Madness.

  57. Bill Geiger's Gravatar Bill Geiger
    March 8, 2016 - 10:45 am | Permalink

    Columba got my vote with his rebuke of Nessie: “YOU SHALL NOT PASS!!”

  58. Curtis Spear's Gravatar Curtis Spear
    March 8, 2016 - 11:12 am | Permalink

    My professor [Larry Hatab of Old Dominion University, in Norfolk, Virginia] taught a class in 1980 titled “Mysticism East and West”. When he was discussing Eckhart, he explained that we needed to understand that Eckhart had an advanced audience for much of his preaching, or as he put it, innocently [unconsciously!] using a turn of phrase, “He was preaching to a hot bed of nuns”. The class laughed greatly at this Freudian slip and he blushed at his words !!

    A theological game ensues. “First half” : … Is this too risque for the arguably [???] pious SEC to allow to be posted?
    … OR … Is this very allowing what makes the SEC greatly human !?

    “Second half”: … Consider only one trinitarian question: 1 Would God laugh? 2 Jesus? 3 The Holy Spirit? Only one Holy Yeah is needed for this post to make the SEC cut!! Such a split result would affirm complex humor amid the trinity – don’t humans too both laugh and not laugh at a thought sometimes. … And further, if we are made in God’s image, and we find it humanly humorous, would not God also? Even if with a bit of a holy groan! And is this site not one of occasional holy groans? And is that not indeed the very reason why God is “well pleased” with it !!

    “Final two minutes”: If no one person of the trinity laugh [enough], do not at least [some of] the saints laugh? And if so, do we really need a vote from the trinity at all??

    “Over time”: This is, sort of, like the reasoning of Lot of course, but did not God let Lot win the argument? So now I have thus also sited settled “case law”, Genesis 18: 23-33. … So … “God said it, I believe it, that settles it!”

    The case is thus closed!! The game is won!! … Post it!!!

    • Curtis Spear's Gravatar Curtis Spear
      March 8, 2016 - 12:17 pm | Permalink

      to moderator: I emailed this post re my professor’s words to some friends, some rabbis too, with the subject heading:
      Lent Madness: my post re Eckhart AKA my rabbis taught me to argue like this

      Also I added in my intro to them before my post: [btw, I wish they had non-christian saints !!!]

    • Conny Santana's Gravatar Conny Santana
      March 8, 2016 - 1:28 pm | Permalink

      Love it! Great argument of logic. Thanks.

  59. junebuggin's Gravatar junebuggin
    March 8, 2016 - 11:21 am | Permalink

    Had to vote for Columba because Nessie.

  60. Doris Westfall's Gravatar Doris Westfall
    March 8, 2016 - 11:21 am | Permalink

    I have been to the holy island of Iona twice…in fact, I just happen to be wearing a cross with iona marble in it today. For Iona’s and this man’s influence on my life it must be Columba!

  61. Rosemary's Gravatar Rosemary
    March 8, 2016 - 11:22 am | Permalink

    I have had the blessed good fortune to visit the Isle of Iona and dwell in the spirit of beauty and holiness there. Columba gets my vote.

  62. Char's Gravatar Char
    March 8, 2016 - 11:23 am | Permalink

    I have a Nessie shaped ladle on my kitchen counter, and our daughter Vanessa is nicknamed “Nessa” so I had to go with Columba today!

  63. Lucy Porter's Gravatar Lucy Porter
    March 8, 2016 - 11:26 am | Permalink

    Meister Eckhart, “love has no why”, in honor and memory of my first teacher of Christian Mysticism, Rev. Evelyn Newman.

  64. Anthony Lee's Gravatar Anthony Lee
    March 8, 2016 - 11:31 am | Permalink

    I’m torn between a mystic and a Celt, both of them groups that are dear to my heart. I’m going with Columba (who I think got my vote on the first round). He has enough of a real life going for him that I don’t think he needs all that apocryphal stuff about Nessie. I grant it’s hard to reconcile a guy named “Dove” with fighting in battles, but you know those Celts–and he did repent. And we have monastery at Iona to thank him for. . . . Even so, it was a close call for Eckhart.

  65. Marney's Gravatar Marney
    March 8, 2016 - 11:34 am | Permalink

    Back in the dark ages (the1970s), Forward Movement had a wonderful Lenten devotional called Holy Island that focused on Iona. I wore my copy out. Does anyone know where I can get another?

  66. Judi Putnam's Gravatar Judi Putnam
    March 8, 2016 - 11:36 am | Permalink

    Although Columba’s voice and choice of location make him a favorite for me, the inclusion of the Loch Ness myth denigrates all of his good works. Meister’s view of God and good outweighs the myth.

  67. Fiona's Gravatar Fiona
    March 8, 2016 - 11:37 am | Permalink

    Against almost anyone else, I would happily vote for Meister Eckhart, but as a member of the Iona Community I can not vote for anyone but Columba. Sailing to Iona with his 12 companions, Columba carried with him the ‘little book’ of God, the bible, but sought always to learn from the ‘great book’ of God, creation. Iona is still a sanctuary and a light, a blessed place that nourishes the soul and sends people back out into the world to bear that light.
    (And on an utterly irreverent side note, the potential for Nessie related kitsch is not insignificant.)

  68. Barbara MacR's Gravatar Barbara MacR
    March 8, 2016 - 11:46 am | Permalink

    Columba for me. He made huge mistakes but worked all his life to make recompense. That’s an invaluable role model. And what recompense! Iona was a lighthouse for learning for more than two centuries. But he didn’t just stay on the island. Nessie aside, he ministered to those notoriously tough customers, the Picts. He stuck to his guns–that blindfolding story…whoa….But I’m delighted to learn about the marvelous Meister Eckhart, about whom I would never have known if not for Lent Madness.

  69. Mary W.'s Gravatar Mary W.
    March 8, 2016 - 11:49 am | Permalink

    Last week’s gospel was the parable of the Prodigal Son. So, with sympathy for Meister Eckhart, I am voting for Columba because he is the prodigal son of today. He sinned, he repented big time, and served the rest of his life in good faith.

    Besides, he converted Nessie. ‘Nuff said. If Meister Eckhart had converted Grendel, then it might be a closer choice.

  70. Cheryle Cerezo-Gardiner's Gravatar Cheryle Cerezo-Gardiner
    March 8, 2016 - 11:54 am | Permalink

    The Celtic tamer of monsters or the mystic? I have to go with the mystic, perhaps because of my own frustrated aspirations!

  71. Diane's Gravatar Diane
    March 8, 2016 - 11:57 am | Permalink

    As the daughter of a Scot, I feel that anyone who can convert Nessie gets my vote. Perhaps a Nessie and Columba pint would be in order?

  72. Martha Camele's Gravatar Martha Camele
    March 8, 2016 - 12:01 pm | Permalink

    The parish I was baptized in was named after Columba. And as a retired Librarian I love anyone who promotes books and literature. Great respect for Meister Eckhart, but St. Columba for me!

  73. Leslie Steffensen's Gravatar Leslie Steffensen
    March 8, 2016 - 12:09 pm | Permalink

    “What’s so funny ’bout peace, love and understanding?” Elvis Costello echoed Meister Eckhart. This is a message the world needs today!

  74. Curtis Spear's Gravatar Curtis Spear
    March 8, 2016 - 12:13 pm | Permalink

    to moderator: I emailed this post re my professor’s words to some friends, some rabbis too, with the subject heading:
    Lent Madness: my post re Eckhart AKA my rabbis taught me to argue like this

    Also I added in my intro to them before my post: [btw, I wish they had non-christian saints !!!]

  75. March 8, 2016 - 12:17 pm | Permalink

    Columba all the way!

  76. Phil Kober's Gravatar Phil Kober
    March 8, 2016 - 12:21 pm | Permalink

    Born on June 20, 1/4 Irish, and St. Columba is still one of my favorite Irish hymn tunes! St. Columba gets my vote again!

    • Phil Kober's Gravatar Phil Kober
      March 8, 2016 - 12:23 pm | Permalink

      And I am an 1/8 Scottish too! Who else could I vote for?

  77. March 8, 2016 - 12:36 pm | Permalink

    What a dilemma! On the one hand, I SHOULD vote for Meister Eckhart because he is one of the fathers of my own ministry of spiritual direction. On the other hand, I SHOULD vote for Columba who is one of my beloved Celtic saints. Finally, tradition won out over experience, and Columba got the prize. Lent Madness is giving me a headache!

  78. Verdery's Gravatar Verdery
    March 8, 2016 - 12:40 pm | Permalink

    Another difficult choice. This time because the two are very different, yet admirable.
    Going with Eckhart because “love has no why” resonated.

  79. Michelle Jackson's Gravatar Michelle Jackson
    March 8, 2016 - 12:49 pm | Permalink

    Columba it is, having just visited Iona last May, and sat on the grass where he wrote his sermons. Iona is wonderful.

  80. Barbara Gay's Gravatar Barbara Gay
    March 8, 2016 - 12:54 pm | Permalink

    Had to go with Meister Eckhart. We need his teachings more than ever, especially among people who have no idea of God or Christianity.

  81. Mollie Douglas Turner's Gravatar Mollie Douglas Turner
    March 8, 2016 - 12:56 pm | Permalink

    Love Iona. Love Loch Ness (not so much Nessie, though I’m glad to know she actually converted). Love Columba and that stained glass window at the abbey. Love Megan. And Columba’s feast day, 9 June, is an important date of various and recurring significance in my life. Love Oliver, too. So even though I also love Meister Eckhart and mystics, and even though my husband, whom I love dearly, says he’d vote for Eckhart, it’s Columba for me again today. Love has no why, indeed.

  82. Conny HICKS/DUGAN Santana's Gravatar Conny HICKS/DUGAN Santana
    March 8, 2016 - 1:03 pm | Permalink

    Oh yeah, and where would LentMadness be without its Irish constituency in this the month of Irish Madness? Seems like there’s always an Irish saint to bedevil the bracket, aye? Love Mister Meister’s spirituality, but it’s just got to be Columba for me.

  83. Pastor Deb's Gravatar Pastor Deb
    March 8, 2016 - 1:12 pm | Permalink

    Celtic religion talks about the “thin places.” Meister Eckhart LIVED in a thin place and through writing and preaching invited others to join him there. Columba’s story is quite enchanting but for lasting value it has to be the mystic.

    • Adrian's Gravatar Adrian
      March 8, 2016 - 3:13 pm | Permalink

      I thought the description of Meistersinger Eickart, beautifully written and left me feeling I wanted to learn more. Columbas while once the patron St of Scotland was all about the Nessie legend and honestly jolly but silly
      So it’s Eickart for me

      • Davis Dassori's Gravatar Davis Dassori
        March 8, 2016 - 7:47 pm | Permalink

        Aha! Auto-correct, so falsely named, claims another victim!

  84. Karen Ashbrook's Gravatar Karen Ashbrook
    March 8, 2016 - 2:03 pm | Permalink

    Here is a poem about St Colmba
    The Pets by Robert Farren (1909-1984) from Dublin
    Colm had a cat,
    And a wren,
    And a fly.

    The cat was a pet,
    And the wren,
    And the fly.

    And it happened that the wren
    Ate the fly;
    And it happened that the cat
    ate the wren.

    Then the cat died.

    So Saint Colm lacked a cat,
    And a wren,
    And a fly,

    But Saint Colm loved the cat,
    And the wren,
    And the fly.

    So he prayed to get them back
    Cat and wren;
    And he prayed to get them back
    wren and fly.

    And the cat became alive
    and delivered up the wren;
    And the wren became alive
    and delivered up the fly;
    And they all lived with Colm
    Til the day came to die.

    First the cat died.
    Then the wren died.
    Then the fly.

    • Peg S.'s Gravatar Peg S.
      March 8, 2016 - 2:58 pm | Permalink

      [wild applause, whistling, table pounding]

      • Conny Santana's Gravatar Conny Santana
        March 8, 2016 - 10:34 pm | Permalink

        Me too, me too! Whistle, clap, whistle!

        • andrea's Gravatar andrea
          March 8, 2016 - 10:59 pm | Permalink

          Bravo! Claps and whistles!

  85. Margaret's Gravatar Margaret
    March 8, 2016 - 2:19 pm | Permalink

    Most of my ancestors are from Scotland. Maybe Columba converted one or more of them. So I vote for him.

  86. Linda Burnett's Gravatar Linda Burnett
    March 8, 2016 - 2:20 pm | Permalink

    With St Patrick’s Day a mere 2 weeks away I couldn’t vote for anyone but Columba today. In honor of my Celtic ancestry, of course.

    • Davis Dassori's Gravatar Davis Dassori
      March 8, 2016 - 8:00 pm | Permalink

      I can’t help wondering why it’s only us Irish-Americans, and not us German-Americans or us Italian-Americans, who make such a point of voting our ancestry. Being all three, I can ask that question. (And yes, I wrote “us,” and not “we,” advisedly.)

  87. March 8, 2016 - 2:24 pm | Permalink

    Meister Eckhart’s story was the most compelling one to me, even though the thought of Iona, and what it is today, is a draw.

  88. Dawna's Gravatar Dawna
    March 8, 2016 - 2:29 pm | Permalink

    Somewhat tough choice for me because I love Eckhart but IONA is in my soul, so had to go with Columba.

  89. Alice Speers's Gravatar Alice Speers
    March 8, 2016 - 3:02 pm | Permalink

    I’m still going with the first round article on M. Eckhart:
    “His German sermons were engaging and poetic, filled with puns and wordplay, drawing heavily on the vocabulary of courtly love, adapting it to speak of the birth of the Word in the soul.” Sounds like a smart guy as well as a faithful one.

    • St. Celia's Gravatar St. Celia
      March 8, 2016 - 3:15 pm | Permalink

      A big salute to the parish of St John the Baptist. Well done.

  90. John's Gravatar John
    March 8, 2016 - 3:08 pm | Permalink

    I was very disappointed in the authors focusing on the nessie story and overlooking the astonishing number of miracles and conversions that St. Columba and his fellow monks accomplished. Especially in relation to the wonderful job the author did on Meister Eckhart. For heaven’s sake read Bede!

    • Jen's Gravatar Jen
      March 8, 2016 - 4:48 pm | Permalink

      Yes, I also found the writing of Eckhart’s bio to be exceptional!

  91. j's Gravatar j
    March 8, 2016 - 3:52 pm | Permalink

    Eckert is a Dominican. End of comment.

  92. March 8, 2016 - 3:53 pm | Permalink

    You have to support a mystic who challenged Thomas Aquinas and lost…. and who has such influence in our contemporary theology. Vote for Meister…

  93. Charlyn's Gravatar Charlyn
    March 8, 2016 - 4:37 pm | Permalink

    Tough decision which story is better. Columbus wins that one. Glad to know sea monsters can be Christian. When we’re sailing and I wonder what we hit this time a rock a sandbar or a Christian sea monster. It certainly beats a lobster pot . I may have to go with the Dominican .

    • Slugger's Gravatar Slugger
      March 8, 2016 - 7:45 pm | Permalink

      Or maybe Columbo… I loved his disheveled appearance and how he was underestimated due to his circumstantiality. I can just see him wearing his rumpled raincoat and smoking a stogie when he commanded Nessie to back down.

  94. Jen's Gravatar Jen
    March 8, 2016 - 4:47 pm | Permalink

    “…and love has no why.” I had never heard of Meister Eckhart before. His LentMadness bio was written so well, I was genuinely moved. It’s always hard to choose, but today I choose Meister Eckhart.

  95. Joe Stroud's Gravatar Joe Stroud
    March 8, 2016 - 4:52 pm | Permalink

    I confess to being a tad skeptical about the Nessie story, but . . . . . . Iona.

  96. Jane's Gravatar Jane
    March 8, 2016 - 5:00 pm | Permalink

    I was kind of inclined to vote for Columba, even though I had, (Lord forgive my skepticism,) doubts about the Nessie thing, but Eckhart’s philosophy/core beliefs more clearly reflected my own, so this time it was the underdog for me!

  97. DonnaK's Gravatar DonnaK
    March 8, 2016 - 5:42 pm | Permalink

    I always feel sorry for people who get undeserved scoldings for things taken out of context. Eckhart gets my vote today.

  98. Katrina Soto's Gravatar Katrina Soto
    March 8, 2016 - 6:24 pm | Permalink

    Since today is the international day of Women , I voted for Meister Eckhart. His faith and spiritual development was much informed by women.

  99. james lodwick's Gravatar james lodwick
    March 8, 2016 - 7:26 pm | Permalink

    Oh Lent Madness, you keep testing our judgment and our piety! I love both Columba and Eckhart, but having made a pilgrimage to Iona and been so moved by my time on that island so saturated with prayer since the time of Columba himself, I had to vote for the sainted abbot. Another Lent madness participant claimed to have favored Columba because he was a doer, not a mystic, but I can’t believe Columba was not also something of a mystic himself. He is said by his biographers to have had visions and apparitions, to have made prophecies and to have written hymns and poems. And how could anyone travel and live among the lovely, and sometimes harsh, sea and sky-girded isles of Ireland and Scotland–Iona above all–and not be somewhat of a mystic? Doers and mystics need each other, and perhaps the truest Christian life contains some of both things. Ora et labora, as Benedict advised!

  100. Alec Clement's Gravatar Alec Clement
    March 8, 2016 - 8:07 pm | Permalink

    My wife and I visited Iona, worshipped at the Abbey and felt Columbas presence. What astory

  101. March 8, 2016 - 8:26 pm | Permalink

    Columba is the man. Having been to Iona I am so impressed that he traveled all over Scotland. Iona is a treacherous journey to with a car. Columba is my favorite so he will get my vote throughout the madness.

  102. Richard Gatjens, age 63's Gravatar Richard Gatjens, age 63
    March 8, 2016 - 9:21 pm | Permalink

    I vote for Meister Eckhart because he’s a natty dresser (love that halo) with lovely drapes to pose in front of and Columba looks like a wimp!

    • St. Celia's Gravatar St. Celia
      March 9, 2016 - 1:04 am | Permalink

      Also like your new moniker. Next year you will be able to change it to “Richard Gatjens eight years old x eight years old” and that will be too precious.

  103. Linda from St. Ed's's Gravatar Linda from St. Ed's
    March 8, 2016 - 10:22 pm | Permalink

    To be honest, everyone’s favorite “love has no why” quote leaves me cold. However, I love Eckhart’s thought that “the Father speaks the Son always, in unity, and pours out in him all created things.” Beautiful.

    Nevertheless, my vote goes to Columba for his missionary work and establishment of an important center for Celtic Christianity. And the Nessie “myth” that many find so off-putting…I find it fairly believable in comparison to the traditions about some other early saints. Does that make me a nutter? 😉

  104. Slugger's Gravatar Slugger
    March 8, 2016 - 10:49 pm | Permalink

    Hey! SEC I have an idea! After the first round, how about a link so we can easily go back to prior biographies?

  105. andrea's Gravatar andrea
    March 9, 2016 - 12:22 am | Permalink

    Columba. For founding the abbey at Iona, spreading Christianity throughout Scotland and converting Nessie. I also like his story of sin/repentance and that he was a book lover.

  106. March 9, 2016 - 1:08 am | Permalink

    Thanks to Celebrity Blogger Derek Olsen for leading off with a Meister Eckhart quote that finally made some sense out of the image being used as the logo for the Jubilee Year of Mercy!! I’m still finding it somewhat creepy, but at least now I have some context.

    Voting for Eckhart on International Women’s Day partly because he learned from and valued the contributions of women. (And because hagiography involving the Loch Ness Monster just doesn’t do it for me.)

  107. March 9, 2016 - 6:06 am | Permalink

    Iona. Without it, we might not have John Bell…or Wild Goose Publications…or all the other rich prayers and music that continue to feed so many of us. Someday, I hope to go and it would be fun to take a St. Columba Golden Halo mug there, unless one of you beats me to it 🙂

Comments are closed.