Roch vs. Julian of Norwich

There's still one vote to go and a full twenty-four hours before full onset Lent Madness Withdrawal (LMW) sets in! So make this one count as Roch faces Julian of Norwich. Will this battle go to the dogs? Or will all manner of things be well?

To get to this round, Roch defeated Gertrude while Julian snuck past William Wilberforce. The winner will face Albert Schweitzer in the Elate Eight. While yesterday, Sojourner (Nothing but the) Truth slammed the door shut on Frances Joseph Gaudet 67% to 33%.

After a full week of Saintly Sixteen action, we have just two more slots up for grabs in the Elate Eight. Today's battle will decide one of them and on Monday the last matchup of this round will see Dietrich Bonhoeffer take on Barnabas. The field is narrowing as the chase for the coveted Golden Halo continues.

Roch

47173411On the day that Roch/Rocco/Roque snuck by Gertrude for the win, our house was infected with a modern plague: the flu. As we lay weeping and gnashing our own teeth and shamelessly wanting our mommy (this is the 40-year-old talking), our dog got out and was attacked by another animal. In the midst of the plague, my dog needed surgery for five puncture wounds and as I write, he lays at my feet, recovering. He is a good dog.

For a saint that I did not know well going into Lent Madness, Roch seems to be having a rather profound impact on my house in big ways. I cannot help but reflect on the irony of lifting Roch up in the blogging world as plagues and an injured dog infiltrate my world. Such is life. However, this post is not about me, it is about the quirks and quotes of St. Roch.

As I read the MANY comments following Roch vs. Gertrude, several made me laugh--it seems as though a number of readers were deeply appreciative of Roch's well-formed thigh and dashing pose. Alas, while Roch may look like he is attempting a Calvin Klein bid, in truth the artists of the times display his shapely thigh to show the plague scars. Being unashamed to show the ravages of his disease was an expression of being intimate with the suffering of Christ. Enduring disease and infirmity were seen as a path to martyrdom. The people saw a seemingly healthy individual, albeit scared, as a promise for curing of their own illnesses and disease. Here was proof of God's healing grace in the world.

Lest you think invoking Roch will only ward off illness and disease, his name has also been invoked to ward off vampire attacks.

So, the next time you have the flu or other illness, or the zombie apocalypse is imminent, you can pray to St. Roch, weep and gnash your teeth, and your suffering will show your solidarity with Christ's agony on the cross. You see, we are all saints...

— Anna Fitch Courie

Julian of Norwich

tumblr_mnm62qcjT91r94vvxo1_500As an anchoress in medieval England, Julian of Norwich got to do something most of us only dream of—she went to her own funeral!

The occasion of her being sealed into her cell would have been marked with a momentous liturgy, including a vigil, mass, chanting, and a procession to the anchorage, concluding with a funeral service where Julian would have received the last rites, both symbolic of her death to the world, and pragmatic, since a priest would not be permitted to enter the cell later.

The only thing that prevented her complete isolation from the world were three windows in her cell. One, called the Squint, opened into the church so she could receive communion and follow the services. The second allowed her attendant to deliver food and empty the chamber pot. The third window provided visitors a way to talk to Julian, and if I had been alive then, I certainly would have wanted to!

Julian held a surprising and profound view of sin, especially for her time. On the one hand, she considered self-awareness of our sinful nature to be excruciating: “And to me was shown no harder hell than sin. For a kind soul has no hell but sin.” And yet, she considered sin as an expedient to understanding God’s love. “We need to fall, and we need to be aware of it; for if we did not fall, we should not know how weak and wretched we are of ourselves, nor should we know our Maker's marvelous love so fully.”

Though they pain us, our sins in no way damage God’s love for us, which is ever near: “For as the body is clad in the cloth, and the flesh in the skin, and the bones in the flesh, and the heart in the whole, so are we, soul and body, clad in the Goodness of God, and enclosed.”

In one of her visions, she described seeing a tiny thing in God’s hand, the size of a hazelnut, and understood it was the whole of God’s creation. It seemed so fragile to her that she asked how it could survive. She was told that everything that exists has its being through the love of God.

Perhaps because of this optimistic vision she received, Julian’s end-time view was radically different than most of the church in her day—not one of doom and destruction, but of mystical hope: "It appears to me that there is a deed that the Holy Trinity shall do on the last day…and how it shall be done is unknown to all creatures under Christ…This is the great deed ordained by our Lord God from eternity, treasured up and hidden in his blessed breast…and by this deed he shall make all things well.”

— Amber Belldene

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Roch: Giovanni Battista Tiepolo, Italian (Venice, Italy 1696 - 1770 Madrid, Spain) Julian of Norwich.
Julian: by Marchela Dimitrova

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151 comments on “Roch vs. Julian of Norwich”

  1. Nothing against Roch, but I was glad to get a second chance to vote for Julian. I am a big fan of Wilberforce so I voted for him last time.

  2. Roch running against another mystic, after Gertrude. I don't know how he beat Gertrude, but he sure isn't beating Julian. As I said in the first round, he doesn't seem to have had much to do with dogs aside from being healed by one, and he doesn’t seem to have paid much attention to them after he was healed, so I don't see why he's so closely associated with them. Julian, on the other hand, has some mind-blowing observations on sin and God's love, on eschatology, on God's creation--an incredible mind. "And all shall be well, and all manner of thing shall be well."

  3. Being the patron saint of dogs and plagues is tempting, but even with the extra bonus of warding off vampires, I just don't see that much about Roch when compared to Julian...or whoever she was.

    Of course this probably will make my dog's latest injury turn out to be blowing out the other knee instead of just muscular stuff like the vets think. Hmmm...maybe I'll vote for Roch after all. #saintlyblackmail

  4. Both write ups made me cheer for the saint. Roch for wearing your scars as a sign of hope and proof of God's healing love in the world, and Julian for the image of God holding all of creation like a hazelnut in a hand.
    Voting Julian.

  5. The 'apologia' for Roch above was so compelling, it almost made me change my mind and vote for him rather than for Julian - well done!!!

  6. After doing research on Rock, I had to cast my vote for him because being in the world filled with its plagues and enemies requires so much more courage than sealing the world out. PS Is there a patron saint of rock and roll? Roch/Rocco/Rock seems a great candidate!

  7. Voted for Julian, because we need a word of hope. Roch was surely scarred not scared, but Lord knows we need some more hope-filled voices today.

  8. Julian, hands down. This far into Lent, I need all the positive perspective I can get.
    Happy Lent!

  9. I wish Anna and her household complete recovery, but for me, all shall be Julian.. This choice comes at no small cost to those of us who love puns and have a Pavlovian response to the kitsch possibilities of Roching on. But as others have said, I would love to meet Julian. (Maggie Smith would play her in the movie.) Her beautiful spirit and ageless wisdom and endless love move to me say: All the way with Lady J! The Dame got game!

  10. I too thought of voting for the underdog Roch today because of the delightful bio and the reference to the Zombie Apocalypse, which my middle son often teases me with. If I ever get another dog, I will name him (or her) Rocco.

  11. When I visited Mother Julian's church in Norwich recently there was a beautiful white cat sitting under a tree in the churchyard - definitely a sign.

  12. In the description of the painting of Roch, did you mean scarred (with a scar) or scared (frightened)?

  13. Don't you just love Lent Madness? It's incredible how much I've learned about all these lovely saints. Today's match-up is unfair, SEC! I'm so torn between Roch and Julian and am drawn to both. Alas, I must choose Julian of Norwich. Her optimistic view of mystical hope won me over. Great job writing, Amber and Anna!

  14. I identify more with saints who carry out their good works in the world where the people who suffer need healing from one who has known pain and suffering and has healing scars as proof. Julian will sweep the boards today but I don't relate as well to those who isolate themselves behind a visible barrier from those who need hands on healing. Reading the words of a saint is inspiring but not always enough to heal what ails. So much visionary blogging today .....maybe from the flu meds and a vision or two !

    1. Don't forget that there was a third window, where people could visit and talk to Lady Julian. The "talking cure" can be immensely healing, too....

  15. I voted for Julian because (1) "Little Gidding" and (2) I have to vote for my namesake!

  16. I hope I was not influenced by the fact the Roch story used lay instead of lie, but do think grammar is an important part of communication and here is an example. Really I like being a small brown nut.

  17. Julian, of course, because she saw that God is the goodness that cannot be angry, and that Jesus feeds us like a mother.

    1. Please think about the consequences of Julian's not having a chamber pot to empty. Chamber pots were a feature of one house I lived in in rural Vermont after WW II, and Julian lived at a time when indoor plumbing was confined to England's 1%. Also, please disregard this comment if you were joking.

      1. Thanks so much for all the stories--and particular for speaking to the validity of the anchorite's vocation.

      2. Hey, folks, he's only 3.500 votes behind and there are over 2 hrs. left. Let's go Rocco! How can people be so blind? I'm really worried about all the weeping and gnashing of teeth that's gonna go on once people recognize Roch for who he is: a true golden halo saint! Are we really gonna make him sit for 5 years in LM Limbo until he's eligible again?

  18. Must support my beloved patron saint! Her words have many times kept me from total despair in grief. She would be the perfect one to win the Golden Halo this year! We so much need her positive loving view of God and his care for us.

  19. Thank you Amber for such a beautiful synopsis of Julian in a crystal clear nutshell.
    All shall be well has new depth of meaning.

  20. I'm usually disinclined to vote for Saints who isolate themselves from the world. Because... ironically, like Julian... I believe that virtue isn't virtue until it comes up against vice. Still, I have to stick with my fellow writer today. I, too, need to believe that God does everything in love ... and “All shall be well, and all shall be well and all manner of thing shall be well...” (Now repeat it until you believe it, Lisa)

  21. Roch's willingness to expose his scars as a symbol of hope is profound, but Julian's sense that through God "all shall be well and all manner of thing shall be well" carries this day for me. Julian, fare FORWARD this DAY (note shameless promotion of SEC's sponsoring organization).

  22. Always loved Julian. Her response to the hazelnut reminds me of William Blake 'to see heaven in a wildflower and eternity in a grain of sand'. Julian for me.

  23. For me this day, it's Julian all the way! We can learn much about God and the faith from the legends of saints like Roch, but Julian teaches us by her own amazing writings about the love and mercy of God. Besides, I have made a pilgrimage to the shrine church of St. Julian in Norwich and have made retreats at the monastery of St. Julian in Wisconsin. Thus I must vote for Julian. At the same time I pray that both Anna and her dog have a happy issue out of all their afflictions, and that, for the sake of the English prose of which Julian was a pioneer, her dog "lies" faithfully and comfortingly at her feet.